AelKennyr Rhiano
Shawn Daysleeper
Cinnamon Raymaker
Lihan Taifun
Dominique Darkwatch
Kellinar Trevellion
Summary:
Tolkien took the name Eärendil (Quenya for “lover of the sea”) from Anglo-Saxon Éarendel, (meaning “bright wanderer”, and referring to the Evening Star). In Old High German the name is Aurvandil and Auriwandalo.
Both Eärendil and Elwing were half-elven. Eärendil's parents were Tuor and Idril Celebrindal. Elwing's grandparents were Beren and Lúthien.
Because the Morning Star was set in the heavens as a sign of hope, immediately before the War of Wrath, the disappearance of the Morning Star (in Fellowship of the Fourth Age roleplay) should be cause for great concern. (The reaction has actually been rather bland so far.)
Does the Silmaril have intrinsic power? Or is it only important because people believe it is important?
Eärendil sailed from Beleriand to The West with a crew of 3 (plus Elwing as a passenger).
Maglor and Maedros killed quite a few elves, first attempting to get the Silmaril that Elwing had, then trying to get the other two that had been in Morgoth's crown. But Maglor did adopt Eärendil and Elwing's two sons, instead of killing them along with the rest of the town. Eärendil and Elwing would have assumed that everyone, including their sons, had been killed.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . ok then, Earendil, the War of Wrath, the Ainur do some serious interfering. Does anyone know when Tolkien was writing the part about Earendil? before or after his buddy Lewis wrote Voyage of the Dawn Treader?
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . Lewis wrote Dawn Treader in 1952
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . am I the only one who sees resemblences between the two stories?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . has been a while since i read The Voyage of the Dawntreader, would have to go back to it again :)
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . ok, well then ...
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Well, I know that the name is derived from Anglo-Saxon Éarendel. And that Tolkien was enamoured of the sound of that name as early as ....ummmm...1912-1913?
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . and what does Éarendel mean, in anglo-saxon?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Eärendil means 'Lover of the Sea'
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . that sounds like him, to like the sound of a word, and then figure out how to work it in. It means that in anglo-saxon?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . and the Anglo-Saxon word means "wanderer",bright wanderer, I think
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . "bright wanderer" -- that's a good name
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . However....
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . anyone read the SIlmarillion chapter? I feel like I am talking to myself
Dominique Darkwatch: . Sorries...I was refilling erm... refreshing my memory
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . awww I just looking through it again
Dominique Darkwatch: . I had not in awhile...had to wiki it to refresh my memory as the final battle of Morgoth
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Earendel is also Aurvandil, which is related to Old High German, Auriwandalo... Auriwandalo is attested as a historical Lombardic prince. A Latinized version, Horvandillus appears as the name of the father of Amleth (Shakespeare's Hamlet) :) Sorry, was checking my facts before I wrote that
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . a well-used name
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Aurvandil was mentioned in the Prose Edda. Which is a collections of tales from Norse mythology
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . Earendel appears in ancient Christian mythology as the brightest of Angels
AelKennyr Rhiano smiles and nods
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . not under the name "Earendil", though
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . well, the Anglo-saxon name points to Auriwandalo as the morning star that heralds the rising sun, as in Christ
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . Auriwandalo does? wow That's the "bright wanderer" part again?
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . Aurvandill and Auriwandalo
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . The Old Norse together with the Anglo-Saxon evidence point to an astronomical myth, the name referring to a star, or a group of stars, and the Anglo-Saxon in particular points to the morning star as the herald of the rising Sun.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . ya hehe
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E%C3%Aurendil
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . http://tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Earendil
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . so very strong mythological connection between Earendil's name, and the morning star
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . which is a hallmark of Tolkien
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . the anglo-saxon and high germanic names, yes, from which earendil is derived
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . well, sometimes he just borrows the names, and puts them in a totally different context
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . that too
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . ok, so we have a strong connection between Earendil and the morning star
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . nod nod nod "Now when first Vingilot was set to sail in the seas of heaven, it rose unlooked for, glittering and bright; and the people of Middle-earth beheld it from afar and wondered, and they took it for a sign, and called it Gil-Estel, the Star of High Hope."
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . well, that makes it a real downer when Vingilot disappears, doesn't it?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . very much so....very Big Omen
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . yes
Cinnamon Raymaker nods
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . and somewhere there we had Earendil keeping watch that Morgoth didn't escape, too
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . I hope he gets a huge salary from working two jobs :P
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . with hazard pay, apparently
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . For the morning star to disappear....that should strike a cold fear through both Ainur and Elves.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . definitely. Oh, I see Earendil got a third job -- he killed a dragon in the battle
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . man...he is an over-achiever!
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . hehe
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Now, I have to admit I am confused....was Elwing half elven, too?
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . yes. I had to look that one up. She was a granddaughter of Beren and Luthien. That's how she inherited Luthien's Silmarill
Cinnamon Raymaker nods
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . I find it interesting she should have chosen to be elven and he would have chosen human.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . And Beren had a cousin who was an ancestor of Tuor who married Idril, and Tuor and Idril were Earendil's parents, so there was half-elven on both sides
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . ok
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . I would think that to hear of the disappearance of the morning star would profoundly affect all the eldar elven races....because of this War of Wrath.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . because the appearing of the morning star had been a sign of hope?
AelKennyr Rhiano nods. I think the disappearance may cause ones like Ingwe, for example, and others to think that perhaps we are heading for another War. another confrontation or dark time.
Dominique Darkwatch listens attentively
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . every age has it's big war
Dominique Darkwatch: . So..another war.....with the possible escape of Morgoth?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Many civilizations look for potents in the sky to herald big change, I am sure that would be the first fear they would all have, yes.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . I think everyone might be worried about Morgoth escaping
Dominique Darkwatch: . Since this was part of Earendil's job..to watch that he didn't
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . And if he were to be found still imprisoned, that may perhaps cause greater fear if the whole of Ea seemed to be embroiled in chaos.
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Oh, good point !
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . "But Morgoth himself the Valar thrust through the Doors of Night beyond the walls of the World, into the TImeless Void; and a guard is set for ever on those walls, and Earendil keeps watch upon the ramparts of the sky"
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . hmmm
Dominique Darkwatch: . Oh dear
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Poor Elwing never gets time with her hubby!
Dominique Darkwatch: . Earendil guards the guard, so to speak
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . ll!
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . "Yet the lies that Melkor sowed in the hearts of Elves and Men are a seed that does not die and cannot be destroyed; and ever and anon it sprouts anew, and will bear dark fruit even unto the latest days."
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . He has a day and a night job!
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . She might have to rescue him yet hehehe
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . that would be sweet
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . heh heh
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . she's stuck somewhere else atm though
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . and the Silmaril, don't forget the Silmaril
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . hehehe ***Yes*** oh, would that call to Elwing I wonder
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . So...which is worse...to have Melkor freed from his prison, or able to direct a new evil from within his prison?
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . well, his evil is almost self-propagating, even when he is in prison
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Would what call to Elwing?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . the silmaril
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . the Silmaril. She does seem to have a connection to it
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . the silmarls are not really magical, eh?
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . not clear. That much Light from the Trees must have some power
Cinnamon Raymaker nods
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . By the 4th Age, where would it be?
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . Earendil has the silmaril
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . was it not with earendil still
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . Elwing believed it had power, when she tried to keep it from the Noldor, and a lot of strange things happened to Elwing and Earendil, when they were travelling with the Silmaril
Dominique Darkwatch: . Didn't Beleren burn his hand on it, and didn't it do something to the wolf that swallowed it?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . and it must have....because Ulmo responded to her plea for help in a very extraordinary way?
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . yes
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . ***Yes***
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . and, with it, they sucessfully travelled to the Blessed Lands
Cinnamon Raymaker nods
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . yes, no small feat
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . indeed
Dominique Darkwatch: . So there is something extraordinary about them
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . However.... sometimes, you embue something with power because you believe it is powerful. It had become a focus of attention and conflict and belief in its importance.
Cinnamon Raymaker nods
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . I saw them as a legacy symbol, rather than having real power
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Perhaps that was enough to keep it from falling into Noldor's hands.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . legacy?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Like capturing the enemy's standard on the battlefield.
Dominique Darkwatch: . I don't think anyone ever argued the point of their worth
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . ya, legacy of the legendary ages, of the light of the trees
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . no, I don't think so, either, Dominique
Dominique Darkwatch: . Melkor himself made them his crown jewels
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . ya they are priceless, but, I am not sure they were really powerful in themselves
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . that is a very good question.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . the palantiri were more useful, than the silmarls for instance
Dominique Darkwatch: . They were a source of light, but also a source of corruption not unlike the one ring
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . if Earendil dropped it, and it was found by someone who knew nothing of it's history, would it still be "magical" for them?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . so if they have power, it is neither of good nor evil.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . they may see it as a valuble gemstone
Dominique Darkwatch: . They were coveted by all, including the valar
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . And the silmaril is still with Earendil?
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . last we knew
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . ya I believe so
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . oh, boy....
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . the silmaril is the morning star light
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . the Silmaril is what makes the morning star so shiny
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . so when the morning star disappeared...so did the silmaril.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . ya hehe, so, dark forces could have captured it
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . yep
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . whatever happened to the Mariner
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Wow, aside from Olwe and Elwing, everyone else is being rather blaise about its disappearance.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . that seems the most likely explanation so far
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . evil or just dissappeared
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . i agree. They don't really get it. hehehe
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . yeah, but even the Valar are not reacting. wow
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . has to be some explanation
Dominique Darkwatch: . Sooo...this whole thing needs to be rediscovered
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . nod nod nodnod
Dominique Darkwatch: . The legend and what it means
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . ya the Valar ned to react to it's dissapearance
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . sheesh, the Valar hardly react to anything -- bunch of sleeping Valar
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . no kidding! Olwe had a big reaction on the deck of the swanship....I was going to refer to it again in future rps
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . Nole and Elenwe had a reaction
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . yes, but considering everything....rather mild...Daza had a mild reaction.
Dominique Darkwatch: . I guess perhaps Arien might take note of it....she's kind of used to just doing her thing
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . She may not known the significance.
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . thing is there are three silmarils - one in the skies, one in the fires in the heart of the world and one in the seas --their "long homes". Reading that chapter
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Oh, someone goes for the one in the sea, and Ulmo would be all over that.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . you suppose Ulmo knows where the one in the sea is?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . I do...because Ulmo is supposedly the most "informed" of the Valar. Telegraph, Telephone, Tell-a-Ulmo
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . lol
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . hahaha
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . so - who is the one who needs to react to this one, the heavens
Dominique Darkwatch: . No..if it was missing she would know its significance. And the eclipse is an elaborate dance between her and Tilion that is rare....that would've ben a good occasion
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . But remember, she is living 4 ages later. And in middle earth...so....would she know the full ramification? Oh, I meant Dominque the cleric...sorry
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . I would expect Arien to realize the significance of VIngilot going missing
Dominique Darkwatch: . She would remember the war of wrath...as involved her kindred ainur as well as her balrog cousins
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Yes, I believe Arien would indeed know and remember. Sorry for the mind slip, there.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . Dominique the cleric would know the old history, and be aware what kind of bad omen this was
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . but only if someone kept the history alive.
Dominique Darkwatch: . As a clerique....yes...I would have to "rediscover" the legends in ancient scrolls as this is how she has been brought along...apart from direct revelation
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . oh, that is good
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . And if none around her act...that would imply that perhaps it has been lost over the course of time. oooouuuu That IS good
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . yes
Dominique Darkwatch: . But there is no one in Sylvhara who knows, yes
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . it's been cloudy a lot in Sylvhara?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Daza noticed the disappearance of the morning star. But .....roflmao AelKennyr Rhiano winks at Shawn...they must not have top notch sailors. Else they would have keenly missed the morning star.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . hehe
Dominique Darkwatch: . But as a mage, his belief system is not along the same lines...this is an academic problem for him
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Agreed
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . I noticed Earendil sailed across the ocean with a crew of 3
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Do we know who they were?
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . their names were mentioned: "Falathar, Erellont, and Aerandir"
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . they are
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Elves? Vanya elves?
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . would not be vanya
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . no no, ones he brought from middle earth
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . oh, ok
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . maybe sindar
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . but he told them to stay in the ship, when he went ashore on the Blessed Lands, so they were allowed to go home, since they hadn't technically landed. There were sindar sailors in the falas region, under Cirdan. Of course, he TOLD Elwing to stay in the ship, too, but she didn' t obey
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . lol
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . she insisted on coming with him
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . hmmmmm....would be interesting to know if all three were with him when the morning star disappeared.
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . plucky Lady!
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . her heritage i guess
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . They never were on the morning star. The Valar sent them back home to middle earth
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Is EOk...confused.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . I think they left Valinor before earendil became the star
Dominique Darkwatch: . So Earendil mans the ship alone?
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . yes
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . I thought you found a mention where they helped Earendil steer the morning star.
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . it looks that way
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . the three elves helped earendil and elwing get to valinor from beleriand, to petition to the valar
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . yes, that I remember
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . no, I said he sailed from middle earth across the ocean with a crew of 3, which sounds like a pretty sweet ship
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . they steered the ship on mortal waters, never as the star
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . yes.....I just got confused.....blushes
Shawn Daysleeper smiles
Dominique Darkwatch: . Once the Valar got a whiff of the Silmarils, they would have found a way for that ship to reach them
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . so Nole probably doesn't need much of a crew, in coastal waters heh heh
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . nope hehe, Nole's a pro
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . heh heh
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . "Maglor answered: 'If it be truly the Silmaril which we saw cast into the sea which rises again by the power of the Valar, then let us be glad; for its glory is seen now by many, and is yet secure from all evil.'"
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . Why was it Elwing and Earendil could handle the Silmaril safely? and no one else could
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . Maglor was noldor, perhaps?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . maybe because they represented a meeting of the races
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . yes, he was. Maglor was one of the Sons of Feanor
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . right
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . getting really tired of the Oath by then
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . so maybe their oath backfired on them when they actually had a silmarl, it seems like he killed to get it after the war was over
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . Maglor - didn't he take the sons of earendil and elwing
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . ya, him and the one that had the silmarl that ended up in the fire of earth. They killed to get them. The last two sons of feanor
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . Maglor was the one who took Elrond and Elros, yes
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . but they didn't kill elros and elrond. If they had things would not have panned out they way they did
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . yes, but Elwing didn't know that
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . ah
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . k, I thought they killed someone to procure the silmarls
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . she and Earendil thought there was nothing left to go home to
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . right
Dominique Darkwatch: . wait......they kidnaped Elwing and Earendil's sons?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . they brought them up
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . well, "kidnapped" or "rescued from the sack of their homeland"
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . Maglor took pity on them and cherished them it says
Dominique Darkwatch: . Oh...well that's good then!LOL!
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . Earendil was off at sea, Elwing had just jumped into the sea holding the Silmaril, to keep it from the invading army
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . this is such a sad tale. Cinnamon Raymaker sniffs
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . I think Elwing assumed everyone was going to be killed
Cinnamon Raymaker nods
Dominique Darkwatch: . wow
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . most of the elves in the settlement were killed, I think
Dominique Darkwatch: . In the war of wrath
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . probably why she jumped in the ocean
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . and then, later Maglor and Maedhros killed the guards ( probably Vanyar) who were guarding the other two Silmarils that had been taken from Melkor
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . Yet he yielded at last to the will of Maedhros, and they took counsel together how they should lay hands on the Silmarils. And they disguised themselves, and came in the night to the camp of Eönwë, and crept into the place where the Silmarils were guarded; and they slew the guards, and laid hands on the jewels. Then all the camp was raised against them, and they prepared to die, defending themselves until the last. But Eönwë would not permit the slaying of the sons of Fëanor; and departing unfought they fled far away. Each of them took to himself a Silmaril, for they said: 'Since one is lost to us, and but two remain, and we two alone of our brothers, so is it plain that fate would have us share the heirlooms of our father.'
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . and one of them jumped into fires of the earth hehe
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . But the jewel burned the hand of Maedhros in pain unbearable; and he perceived that it was as Eönwë had said, and that his right thereto had become void, and that the oath was vain. And being in anguish and despair he cast himself into a gaping chasm filled with fire, and so ended; and the Silmaril that he bore was taken into the bosom of the Earth,
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . so two were lost
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . lost, although we might think Aule and Ulmo know where to find them
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . nod nod nod
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . now we have to find the other one again
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . yes indeed
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . it seems Maglor may have survived
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . I was thinking that, too, Shawn
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . And it is told of Maglor that he could not endure the pain with which the Silmaril tormented him; and he cast it at last into the Sea, and thereafter he wandered ever upon the shores, singing in pain and regret beside the waves. For Maglor was mighty among the singers of old, named only after Daeron of Doriath; but he came never back among the people of the Elves.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . so he could have survived the events of the 1st age
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . how could he be a foster-father to Elrond and Elros if he disappeared so soon after?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . hmm
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . in whic case someone could npc him lol
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . how long between when Earendil sailed, and the War of Wrath?
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . it seems that the timing is not clear
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . hmmmmm, good question, but I don't know
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . maybe he took it away and kept it for a while before throwing it into the sea
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . well, that's true, maybe there was some time elasped before he threw it into the sea
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . hehehe ***Yes*** I think the statement in the chapter was just about what happened to the silmarils Lihan
Dominique Darkwatch: . It sounds like we might need an Earendil.....do we have one?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . we did have, but he doesn't rp
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . could npc Maglor, either as surviving, or as having served his time in Mandos and been released
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . No, no, we do not. We have no Earendil in the 4th Age.
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . ah ok. Was thnking of before
Dominique Darkwatch looks at Cinnamon "Any prospects?"
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . for earendil?
Dominique Darkwatch: . yes
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . had thought he had disappeared. hehe
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . he did
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . ya
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . i know
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . well, how can anyone rescue him?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . i don't have any ideas. Hang on, were you talking about another player, or were you talking about a rescue
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . huh?
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . valar rescue team?
Dominique Darkwatch: . Sooo....how did this idea for the disappearance of the morning star come about? Was there some thought as to its ramifications and resolution?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . k - elwing still has recall of Ulmo to consider,probably need the help of the valar
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . unless the Vanyar want a quest?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . It was inspired by the fact that Cinnamon did not have/want/need a Earendil.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . ya, would be a good possibility for the vanyar
Kellinar Trevellion snort...somebody say quest?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . heheh
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . are the Vanyar getting bored?
Kellinar Trevellion: . . . . What quest?
Dominique Darkwatch: . hahaha
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . huh?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . hehehe
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . rescuing Earendil the morning star
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . and recovering the Silmaril
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . so Elwing 's heart is mended, and the hope of all is restored
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . we will find him
Kellinar Trevellion: . . . . O.O Um....I'm as clueless as to Earendil's whereabouts.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . you and the rest of the universe
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . lol
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Those would be very good as possible storylines. However....they would need a lot of forethought and developement because they do not need to be rp that is hurriedly resolved.
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . ok then thats homework
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . No, I did not say that.
Kellinar Trevellion: . . . . Perhaps the other two silmarils may point to the missing Earendil?
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . plausible
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . I think before you embark on these as possiblities, you need to spend ALOT of time considering them for all angles.
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . indeed
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . or you will be very disappointed with the results, and it will not be all that it could be as a good rp.
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . and as always we put them by you Ael
AelKennyr Rhiano blushes...actually before the rp leaders...
Kellinar Trevellion: . . . . Yup...and I know next to nothing!
Cinnamon Raymaker: . . have you read the cards Kell? hehehe
Kellinar Trevellion: . . . . I mean about the silmarils.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . I think there was some prophecy that the other two Silmarils will not be recovered until after the Last Battle
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . yes,I believe you are right, Lihan.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . oh?
Dominique Darkwatch: . aye...I'm hearing the morning star idea was not entirely thought through
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . So, things like that would have to be researched.
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . It was developed to explain why Elwing was in the rp without her spouse, and has been useful as an omen of evil things to come.
Cinnamon Raymaker nods. Except no one except Olwe saw it as such
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . To say it was not thought through is not accurate, because we never discussed it being more than that.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . and it keeps working just fine as long as we don't need to find him immediately
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . yes. It CAN be developed into a storyline...easily.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . ya it could
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . It just needs very directed thought, planning and a definite long term goal.
Dominique Darkwatch: . Okay...so it is okay if people start getting excited about it?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Oh, yes, they should....
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . the stars in the heavens are important to a variety of peoples. Astrologers, astronomers, sailors, mages, clerics...elves, ainur...should all be flipping out. And humans, Just to name a few.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . Nole has
Dominique Darkwatch: . And we can get some flipping as long as it goes somewhere
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . And it can.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . it is certainly an omen of "evil on the loose"
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . nod nod nod nod nod nod I mean, Earendil has never called in sick on his job before....now he is gone!
Cinnamon Raymaker cringes
Dominique Darkwatch: . Soo...Elwing is well aware of this already, yes?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . yes. Olwe, too. Nole and Elenwe
Cinnamon Raymaker nods
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . the Ainur Council knows. Daza reacted to the star, if not the significance
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . which is what you would expect
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . yes
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . So, for example, Dominque could be giving the Sylvan elves the wake-up call...."Oh, wow, something is very wrong."
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . Dominique would think of the story of Earendil as "history", where Daza would think of it as "some foreign legend", right?
Dominique Darkwatch: . Yeah...I've been preoccupied with the plight of Olwe
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . That would be my thought. And that is not unexpected.
Dominique Darkwatch: . Yes...Daza regards much of this is legend and myth
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . assuming he as even heard that legend
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . exactly
Dominique Darkwatch: . The loss of a star, though, does pique his interest I think...but I'm not sure he woukd see the same significance and connection as me
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . I would be surprised if he did.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . right
Dominique Darkwatch: . Maybe if he met a Vala face-to-face, it might
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . But then, again, would he recognize them for who/what they are?
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . Should we continue this discussion next week, too? It seems we have a definite interest in it.
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . sure :)
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . and we have hardly gotten to the War yet
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . I know!
Dominique Darkwatch: . At least the RP implications...it seems REALLY relevant
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . It does. I am glad we had this topic tonight
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . I was really struck by how relevant this chapter was to the RP
Shawn Daysleeper: . . . . . yes, it is
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . and all the parts about what motivated the Valar to get involved, and the Valar making exceptions. There is a lot in this chapter
Dominique Darkwatch: . Here I was hoping for a slower week! LOL!
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . There is a lot. It makes for some rich discussion.
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . ok , continue this chapter next week!
AelKennyr Rhiano: . . . . . yay!
Dominique Darkwatch: . So if the council knows, that means all of the valar and maiar knows
Lihan Taifun: . . . . . . . . . . yes
